cje
Full Member
Posts: 60
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Post by cje on Nov 7, 2011 18:06:34 GMT -5
I was just thinking about the various types of plant life that was around the Alamo out to say a mile sounding it over the years starting with the time of the siege and then as San Antonio crept in upon the Alamo today. There are some drawings etc. of a tree just outside of the Northwestern wall that in a way is an icon of its own. Also who selected plant life from the early 1900's to the present time and how it is selected and maintained today. Mark Lemon gives several ideas in his wonderful "Illustrated Alamo," book as do several others such as George Nelson. Just a question that I feel interested in but would seek reader's insights. There must be some very interesting stories about this "Alamo" subject. I look forward to reading various replies. Thanks
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Post by Kevin Young on Nov 7, 2011 21:35:16 GMT -5
Eakin Press published a two volume book by Wengier called The Explorers' Texas. Volume 1 delt with Land and Water and Volume 2 with animals. These books delt with what the explorers of Texas up until the 1850's(?) were reporting as they traveled. Great source to understand what was native, what was where, and what was introduced.
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Post by Rich Curilla on Nov 16, 2011 1:07:34 GMT -5
It is interesting to see what has taken on iconographic proportions with plant life around the Alamo. You mentioned the Pecan tree just west of the N.W. corner. It must have been the only large tree in the immediate vacinity of the Mo because it is depicted by Sanchez-Navarro in his drawing of the Alamo from the Veramendi Palace, by Labastida on his battle map for Santa Anna and (probably) on Green Jameson's plat of the fort. In short, it caught everybody's eye. This is why Mark Lemon, George Nelson and Gary Zaboly included it in their art.
The dozen or more cottonwood trees ("Los Alamos") in the Alameda flanked Commerce St. between the two acequia bridges for years after the battle. These were stately trees around fifty or sixty feet high, judging from the Hermann Lungkwitz painting.
A large cypress tree still stands at the bend of the river near Commerce and Soledad Streets that certainly was there in 1835-36 and may be the tree from which the Mexican snyper shot Col. Ben Milam 125 yards away as he emerged from the back door of the Veramendi House.
General Filsola reported that the area immediately around the Alamo was clear but that there were forests in the area. With the exception of the area between the Alamo and Bexar, the river was basically lined with trees.
Labores (farmers' fields) of the mission came almost up to the walls on all sides but the south, but, of course, in March they were dormant.
Hermann Ehrenberg described the area between Bexar and the old mill upstream on the right bank of the river, saying that part of it was a corn field with trees along the river bank but once you moved away from the river a few hundred feet, you were in thick prickly pear cactus (like Brackettville terrain).
Think far more "green and growing" than in John Wayne's movie and slightly less than in The Alamo '04.
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cje
Full Member
Posts: 60
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Post by cje on Nov 16, 2011 12:24:23 GMT -5
THANKS! Very good input. The plant life had it's effect on the siege. The Alamo Plant Life post 1900 to present must have been influenced by several individuals as the "Alamo Gardens" were created. I have looked at several pictures and have noticed a wide range of plant life. One popular picture taken looks through the opening/gate from the Convent Yard to view the front of the Chapel Church. Lots of vines etc. all over the wall (now half height) that connects the Long Barracks to the Church/Chapel. I remember in my teens (1960's) trying to find a picture of the rear of the Church/Chapel area. When I went to the Alamo in 1967, I shot a whole lot of pictures/slide of the rear and sides of the Alamo. Anyone have any input as to who has worked on and designed the Alamo Gardens over the years and layed out how it was to be planted? Even in the middle of San Antonio, the plant life gives a feeling in some areas of the old mission perhaps. Sort of like Sutter's Fort in Sacramento that I have often visited. That fort was all there was almost of Sacramento in the early 1800's.
Thanks for past and future input. cje
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Post by mjbrathwaite on Nov 17, 2011 17:56:44 GMT -5
This discussion is very timely: when I went to the Alamo in 1988, it was when I passed through San Antonio in the middle of the night while on a singing tour, so all I saw was the outside. To get an idea of what the interior is like, I tend to watch "Viva Max" about once a year. When I was doing so earlier this week, for the first time it occurred to me to wonder if there were plants growing inside the compound in 1836, as after watching the John Wayne film repeatedly since 1960, I had rather assumed there weren't (although I've always been aware of some of the other inaccuracies in the film). I wish all of my questions about the Alamo could be resolved so easily!
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Post by Rich Curilla on Nov 18, 2011 19:21:14 GMT -5
For a number of reasons, I feel that the Alamo compound was even more bare in 1836 than John Wayne's.
First and foremost, General Cos had begun to fortify it in 1835. This process would have used every scrap of lumber available and then some. Thus, all trees (if any) used up.
Also, the Alamo de Parras company, stationed there for decades previous to Cos and Travis, would have cleared it of extraneous vegetation -- the mission period trees along the acequia in the plaza also long-since removed (if there were any).
And just the wear and tear of so many men so frequently tromping the grounds......
I think the plaza as well as the Plaza de Valero adjoining it to the south of the gate were giant voids of caliche dust with some grass along the acequias.
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Post by Hollowhorn on Nov 18, 2011 19:51:22 GMT -5
Ever so slightly off topic: Can anyone say exactly when the well known 'Pecan Tree' vanished from the pages of history? I have seen it shown on so many maps, plats & drawings over the years, I hope it died a natural death.
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Post by Rich Curilla on Nov 18, 2011 20:26:09 GMT -5
There is a report that it finally fell over -- into Sam Maverick's home. I don't remember who said this (other than me just now ;D) but I think it came from a Maverick. The tree (we believe) can be seen in the 1859-60 photo of the Maverick home on Alamo Plaza.
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Post by Rich Curilla on Nov 18, 2011 20:30:41 GMT -5
Also, Bruce Winders pointed out to me that there are two cottonwood trees (los Alamos) in the Alamo Garden. I have been looking for them all over the place to see what the doggone things looked like and told Bruce this. Then he told me that the Alamo had them on the grounds! If you go out the north door of the Alamo church, turn right, cross the acequia and look to your left, there they are. Young ones. Not as tall as those in the Alameda at the time of the Lungkwitz painting, but very obviously the same kind. ;D
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