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Post by Rich Curilla on Aug 5, 2010 0:38:02 GMT -5
It is a major tradition that Santa Anna had his massed bands play the Deguello! as his men attacked the Alamo in the pre-dawn chill of March 6. Unfortunately, this possibility has much going against it.
1. It was the culmination of a series of bugle calls for the cavalry, not the infantry, specifically designed to accompany a mounted cavalry charge a-la Errol Flynn's Custer at Gettysburg in They Died With Their Boots On. It would have little use for infantry and, as a signal used to convey orders on the battlefield, it would have confused them.
2. It was (I believe) first mentioned by Reuben M. Potter in his 1860 account of the battle, and not heard of before this.
3. No primary sources refer to it, discounting Madam Candelaria's late-19th. century story and, if memory serves, an embellished latter-day Susanna Dickinson account. These were both after Potter's version was well circulated and read.
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Post by garyzaboly on Aug 5, 2010 4:21:05 GMT -5
It is a major tradition that Santa Anna had his massed bands play the Deguello! as his men attacked the Alamo in the pre-dawn chill of March 6. Unfortunately, this possibility has much going against it. 1. It was the culmination of a series of bugle calls for the cavalry, not the infantry, specifically designed to accompany a mounted cavalry charge a-la Errol Flynn's Custer at Gettysburg in They Died With Their Boots On. It would have little use for infantry and, as a signal used to convey orders on the battlefield, it would have confused them. 2. It was (I believe) first mentioned by Reuben M. Potter in his 1860 account of the battle, and not heard of before this. 3. No primary sources refer to it, discounting Madam Candelaria's late-19th. century story and, if memory serves, an embellished latter-day Susanna Dickinson account. These were both after Potter's version was well circulated and read. Intriguing point, Rick, viz., that the DEGUELLO was a cavalry "tune." Some accounts place Santa Anna not at the north battery during the assault, but with the cavalry. Could the DEGUELLO have been played just to psyche-up the dragoons as they intercepted the fleeing defenders? Like so much else here, speculation is often all that we're left with.
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Post by Rich Curilla on Aug 5, 2010 6:30:18 GMT -5
I guess it is possible, but that in itself has problems in that the accounts I trust most place S.A. at the north battery. Could he have relocated during the battle? Would he have?
Also, when you read the fine print in El Soldado Mexicano, the description of the use of the music is very specific. A largo march which repeats itself, then a trot which likewise repeats itself, then a gallop which repeats itself and finally Carga o Deguello (charge and beheading) which is ordered at seventy yards (or some such specific measurement) from the enemy lines so that the engagement (or disengagement, if one refers to the head) occurs at the climax of the piece. The last call -- the Deguello! -- does not repeat. So it seems to me it is planned for a very specific and dramatic charge of a whole line of cavalry, not squads roving around to catch straglers. Although this very detail, if correct, could encourage the image of this being a major plan to push the defenders out and then charge them down as a mass.
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Post by Herb on Aug 5, 2010 10:28:56 GMT -5
If you read Sesma's report: speaking of the breakouts Sesma said "It is in vain to show Your Excellency the desperate resistance of these men because you were in the middle of the risk, dictataing my orders and you were a witness who observed ...." It seems apparent that Santa Anna moved to join him - probably shortly after the North Wall was sucessively scaled.
This only makes sense, for by this time with his reserves committed, the only way Santa Anna could influence the battle was with the cavalry.
Plus, if you think about it, moving to the Main Gate to enter the Alamo it only makes sense that this is the route he would have taken.
I wouldn't make too much about the Deguello being a cavalry call. It's use would be more dependent on whether or not Santa Anna liked it or its message. Though, I do like Gary's idea.
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Post by garyzaboly on Aug 5, 2010 15:26:22 GMT -5
If you read Sesma's report: speaking of the breakouts Sesma said "It is in vain to show Your Excellency the desperate resistance of these men because you were in the middle of the risk, dictataing my orders and you were a witness who observed ...." It seems apparent that Santa Anna moved to join him - probably shortly after the North Wall was sucessively scaled. This only makes sense, for by this time with his reserves committed, the only way Santa Anna could influence the battle was with the cavalry. Plus, if you think about it, moving to the Main Gate to enter the Alamo it only makes sense that this is the route he would have taken. I wouldn't make too much about the Deguello being a cavalry call. It's use would be more dependent on whether or not Santa Anna liked it or its message. Though, I do like Gary's idea. Good reminder, Wolf. And this lends credence to the possibility that Santa Anna did not stay put in any one position during the battle for long. I had recently done some deeper digging into the documentation re: the assault, and was surprised to find Santa Anna's presence---according to Mexican sources----all over the place, from the north battery, to the town battery, to the cavalry in the east. So there doesn't seem to be any concrete agreement. It IS possible he was moving around during the battle and not staying in one place. Eventually he seems to have entered the fort through the south gate, once the action had ended.
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Post by Rich Curilla on Aug 5, 2010 22:00:07 GMT -5
It's use would be more dependent on whether or not Santa Anna liked it or its message. This would be my hedge. Santa Anna was just vainglorious enough to use his favorite music, as per tradition. He could certainly have sent e-mails to all his staff saying it would be used and not to think of it as a cavalry bugle call. (sorry) But, if it were as infamously his personal trademark as the legend makes it seem, then why did absolutely nobody in his army comment on it? De la Pena comes closest but still no cigar when he refers to "that terrible bugle call of death" because he describes it as "a bugle call to attention." He of all people would have made a big deal out of Santa Anna's cutthroat song -- if it had been used.
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Post by elcolorado on Aug 6, 2010 8:25:35 GMT -5
Sergeant Manuel Loranca states (Hansen, page 477) that from a fortified location "...President Santa Anna was with the music of Dolores..." So if the Deguello was indeed a cavalry tune...
Glenn
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Post by Rich Curilla on Aug 6, 2010 19:27:22 GMT -5
Sergeant Manuel Loranca states (Hansen, page 477) that from a fortified location "...President Santa Anna was with the music of Dolores..." So if the Deguello was indeed a cavalry tune... Glenn Wow! I never caught that! Cool. So.... maybe.................. I'll go look. Thanks, Glenn. Good catch.
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Post by Rich Curilla on Aug 6, 2010 19:58:56 GMT -5
Well, I read it and am underwhelmed. Santa Anna being with the music in a small fort to the east must be his mix-up of direction for the emplacement to the northeast -- easy mistake, directions can be confusing now let alone then.
As for the rest of his account, I tend to agree with Hansen: "In all, this account must be considered highly doubtful."
That said, his comment placing Santa Anna "with the music of the regiment of Dolores and his staff to direct the movements" does not seem faked -- too specific, and not out of alignment with other accounts (if we allow him the minor direction error).
I know Walter Lord placed the "massed bands of all the battalions" with Santa Anna at "the earthworks on the north" (even Lord slid the emplacement around the compass a bit), but what was his source. Couldn't have been Loranca. I'll check Potter (which, if so, doesn't help much).
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Post by garyzaboly on Aug 7, 2010 6:48:09 GMT -5
Sanchez-Navarro does indeed write that Santa Anna ordered a bugle to begin the attack, from his position at "a battery between north and east," but no account tells us that he STAYED there. As commander-in-chief, it was his duty to keep track of what was happening all over the field, and to issue orders accordingly. Some of these were apparently orders issued by bugle.
So it's no surprise to learn that he, as Sesma wrote, was soon in the vicinity of the dragoons to witness, and even partly direct, their interception of the Alamo fugitives. Other accounts state that when he finally entered the conquered Alamo, he did so with "his music"----a vague term, but definitely implying at least once incontestable fact: his personal trumpeter had been by his side throughout the entire battle. The only question remains: where do we find confirmation of Potter's 1860 assertion that the deguello was played that morning?
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Post by Rich Curilla on Aug 7, 2010 20:35:30 GMT -5
Do you suppose it is possible that there might be unexplored accounts, reports, letters, etc., from band leaders or personnel in Mexican military archives? Who would have ever thought of them?
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Post by garyzaboly on Aug 8, 2010 4:27:47 GMT -5
Do you suppose it is possible that there might be unexplored accounts, reports, letters, etc., from band leaders or personnel in Mexican military archives? Who would have ever thought of them? One San Jacinto battle report noted that General Cos's papers had been taken, along with Almonte's and others. What happened to Cos's papers?! This is just indicative of the fact that yes, there are probably a lot of first-hand Texas Revolution accounts that have been lost---but whether lost permanently or not is the question.
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Post by marklemon on Aug 8, 2010 7:34:25 GMT -5
As only a small portion of the army was bagged at San Jacinto, my guess is that that the critical reports (battalion commanders after-action reports, etc) remained with the main body, made their way back to Mexico, and reside today in some long forgotten (maybe on purpose) archive. If we had access to Duque's, Cos' Morales' and Romero's reports of the Alamo action, think of the questions that would be answered....
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Post by Herb on Aug 8, 2010 10:38:11 GMT -5
Do you suppose it is possible that there might be unexplored accounts, reports, letters, etc., from band leaders or personnel in Mexican military archives? Who would have ever thought of them? One San Jacinto battle report noted that General Cos's papers had been taken, along with Almonte's and others. What happened to Cos's papers?! This is just indicative of the fact that yes, there are probably a lot of first-hand Texas Revolution accounts that have been lost---but whether lost permanently or not is the question. A large portion of the captured Mexican baggage was burnt on April 23 (see Moore page 390) what remained was auctioned off on April 26 (Moore, 394). There can be little doubt that a large portion of valuable papers, and booty not just from the Mexican Army but the Alamo itself disappeared in these two events. Of the major commanders that participated in the Alamo that should have submitted after action reports only Sesma and Morales were not captured at San Jacinto. Perhaps this is one reason only Sesma's report has been found (and even this is basically a "certified copy" and not the original - was the original with Santa Anna?). Rereading some portions of Davis' Three Roads I came across the nugget that Travis's commision as the Texas Lieutentant Colonel of cavalry was in the Mexican archives, this with the missing Williamson letter implies to me that at least Travis's captured papers survived and are in Mexican Archives. I wonder if its possible they've been overlooked by researchers simply because they were looking for Mexican records and not captured Texian ones?
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Post by Rich Curilla on Aug 8, 2010 16:14:06 GMT -5
Rereading some portions of Davis' Three Roads I came across the nugget that Travis's commision as the Texas Lieutentant Colonel of cavalry was in the Mexican archives, this with the missing Williamson letter implies to me that at least Travis's captured papers survived and are in Mexican Archives. I wonder if its possible they've been overlooked by researchers simply because they were looking for Mexican records and not captured Texian ones? But would a whole pile of Travis' papers have been sent to the capital, or would someone have gone through them and simply sent politically or militarily significant papers -- proof of commission, correspondence related to reinforcement numbers, etc.
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