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Post by pff on Jan 11, 2014 12:35:23 GMT -5
Do the orginal pieces of the Alamo Flag "New Orleans Grays" still exist-or has it been restored so much as to be an good copy?
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Post by Rich Curilla on Jan 12, 2014 11:05:58 GMT -5
The person who would know is Lee Spencer White. She visited Chapultepec two years ago and they actually took the flag out and allowed her to examine it. Attachment DeletedHere it is in its earlier display case. Attachment Deleted
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Post by pff on May 9, 2014 17:46:49 GMT -5
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Post by Riley Gardner on Dec 7, 2014 12:37:21 GMT -5
May I ask why the Mexican Government has been so stubborn when it comes to this flag? I understand it is a part of their history as much as it is Texas history, but they only keep it in storage with the occasionally study and examination (or so it seems) with very little ability for the average person to see it. I'm a firm believer that history - specifically artifacts - ought to be available for the world to view and learn about, as history is a shared experience that affects all. So why doesn't the Mexican government, specifically those who run the archival section, agree with this? I'm just curious as to what their stance is.
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Post by Rich Curilla on Dec 8, 2014 0:26:14 GMT -5
Why don't we give back all the Mexican flags we captured at San Jacinto? I guess they figure they won that flag with blood and they'll keep it. I do agree however that they should have it on constant exhibit -- as we do those at San Jacinto.
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Post by ronald on Jan 4, 2015 9:25:38 GMT -5
I dont remember the site but it was on display in a museum in Mexico you could look at the display
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Post by cantador4u on Jan 8, 2015 22:20:04 GMT -5
I saw it around 1985 at the Chapultepec Castle in Mexico City. at the time I only vaguely knew it had something to do with the Alamo. It was pretty unimpressive to me at the time. - Paul Meske, Chippewa Falls, WI
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Post by Allen Wiener on Jan 19, 2015 14:49:23 GMT -5
Who now has possession of Santa Anna's cork leg?
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Post by Jim Boylston on Jan 19, 2015 15:36:01 GMT -5
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Post by Allen Wiener on Jan 19, 2015 16:29:14 GMT -5
Thanks Jim. Maybe we can do a swap of the leg for the flag!
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Post by 5thgentexan on Jan 22, 2015 15:37:23 GMT -5
Getting that flag has been on the minds of many for a long time. There have even been rewards/bounties put on it. Phil Gramm himself went to Mexico City to get it - and failed. There was even talk of making it a condition of NAFTA. Talk of "swapping" the Alamo flag for three Mexican flags that were taken at San Jacinto then began. The Mexicans weren't to keen on it, mainly because of all the shenanigans some had already tried to pull-off. Then there was a story in the late 90s that then governor George Bush brought it up again, but to just borrow it and "restore it" and display for a awhile. The US Ambassador was even involved. The thing was there was no intent from the get-go to give the Alamo flag back. Needless to say the Mexicans didn't fall for that one, either. Many thought GW Bush later as US President would find some way to get it back. Came up again in 2011 - there was even legislation passed in the Texas Senate, to swap the three San Jacinto flags either temporarily for display purposes or permanently. Many were against it, including Sam Houston's ancestors and the Daughters of Texas. I don't think it ever passed the House.
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Post by Rich Curilla on Jan 22, 2015 18:00:41 GMT -5
It seems to me that "war trophies" belong to the winner. Thus, it is appropriate that we have the leg and the 3 flags and Mexico has the N.O.G. flag. Oh yes, and we also have Texas.
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Post by Herb on Jan 22, 2015 20:00:35 GMT -5
It seems to me that "war trophies" belong to the winner. Thus, it is appropriate that we have the leg and the 3 flags and Mexico has the N.O.G. flag. Oh yes, and we also have Texas. Think you're right. And given the circumstances of the two battles - I think the possession of the San Jacinto trophies is far more significant. JMO.
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Post by Paul Sylvain on Jan 22, 2015 20:32:38 GMT -5
I'd agree with Rich. The flag in question was a war trophy. To the victors go the spoils, as they say. Granted, Santa Anna lost the war, but he won this battle. I'm guessing that at the time no one gave that flag much thought. I think it's importance has grown with time, to the point we'd like to have it back in Texas. I seriously doubt that will ever happen.
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Post by Rich Curilla on Jan 22, 2015 22:21:06 GMT -5
Well, Santa Anna gave it a lot of thought. LOL.
"The bearer takes with him one of the flags of the enemy's battalions, captured to-day. The inspection of it will show plainly the true intention of the treacherous colonists, and of their abetors [sic], who came from the ports of the United States of the North!
God and Liberty! HEADQUARTERS, BEXAR, March 6th, 1836.
(Signed) ANTONIO LOPEZ DE SANTA ANNA.
To His Excellency the Secretary of War and Navy, Gen. Jose Maria Tornel"
His intention seems to have been to ignore (probably burn) constitutional flags or independence flags and emphasize the flag that proved these men were "pirates" by international definition -- fighting under no recognized flag (the U.S. was not at war with Mexico so anybody from New Orleans was operating as a pirate). Piracy was punishable by execution, thus Santa Anna had is carte-blanch to kill everyone.
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