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Post by texasbluebonnet on Mar 17, 2009 8:29:34 GMT -5
What is the most widely supposed way that David Crockett died/was killed at the Alamo?
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Post by Jim Boylston on Mar 17, 2009 8:51:15 GMT -5
What is the most widely supposed way that David Crockett died/was killed at the Alamo? This is one of the most often debated topics related to the Alamo and, at this point, I don't think there's a consensus and I doubt there will ever be a definitive answer. There are a number of good sources that you can peruse to familiarize yourself with the various points of view. I'd suggest reading the series of debates between Thomas Lindley and James Crisp, available here: www.tamu.edu/ccbn/dewitt/adp/archives/archives.html click on Featured Articles, scroll down to the tag for Crockett Debates; Dan Kilgore's "How Did Davy Die?"; William C. Davis's "How Davy Probably Didn't Die"; either of Bill Groneman's books: "Defense of a Legend" or "Death of Legend"; and James Crisp's "Sleuthing the Alamo". There's also plenty of debate to be found online if you search under "De La Pena". Happy hunting! Jim
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Post by Allen Wiener on Mar 17, 2009 9:24:29 GMT -5
Added to which is our recent discussion here about where Crockett died. Davis covers some of this in his article, which Jim mentioned.
AW
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Post by Paul Sylvain on Mar 21, 2009 20:17:07 GMT -5
I doubt this debate will ever be settled, seeing as there is no one alive today who actually saw David fall.
Even if he did surrender, only to be executed, it doesn't diminish from the fact that he stayed and fought against overwhelming odds. It doesn't make him any less a hero figure, in my book. But I think the need by some to dispel that version of events is driven by a desire that he should live up to the legend of him swinging his rifle and fighting hard to the end. It doesn't matter to me how, when or where he died.
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Post by sloanrodgers on Mar 21, 2009 21:39:25 GMT -5
I have enjoyed the lively debates pro and con for each dramatic Davy death over the years. I don't mean to sound like a broken record. Crockett met his maker at the Alamo and that's all his comrades and fans should ask of him. I believe there were several thousand able-bodied Texicans available for military service in 1836, but few answered the call. The heroes of the Alamo, San Jacinto, Gonzales, Goliad, etc. were braver for just partipating in the revolution than the slackers that bragged about it afterward and never shouldered a gun.
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Post by stuart on Mar 22, 2009 3:31:54 GMT -5
Still liked that off-hand "Crockett was killed yesterday" comment from the Time Tunnel episode. For all we really know it might just be true
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Post by garyzaboly on Apr 2, 2009 14:30:10 GMT -5
There's a debate over how Davy died? No way!
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Post by stuart on Apr 2, 2009 15:37:29 GMT -5
Nah, there's no mystery. The Mexicans killed him - dead
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Post by sloanrodgers on Apr 2, 2009 17:31:42 GMT -5
Well, unless friendly fire got 'em. Crockett did say he was with his friends.
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Post by Paul Sylvain on Apr 2, 2009 17:45:41 GMT -5
Dead? Heck no. He was seen just last week knocking down beers with Elvis in Las Vegas.
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Post by Allen Wiener on Apr 2, 2009 21:35:59 GMT -5
I don't think either Crockett or Bowie died at the Alamo. There is no corpus delicti for either of them, nor reliable witnesses who can pin down their deaths, nor any other forensic evidence that would convince us that they died, let alone their manner of death.
I'm thoroughly convinced that Bowie had progressed further along in his recovery from illness than we have been led to believe and was well enough to travel by March 6. I believe that he and Crockett made their way out of the fort through a secret tunnel (long since destroyed) that took them well beyond Sesma's cavalry somewhere in the vicinity of La Villita. With everyone's attention focused on the battle, they were able to easily "borrow" a couple of horses and get out of there in a hurry. They were then able to get provisions for a long journey from Bowie's local Tejano contacts and make their way out of the area, finally arriving at the still-secret location of Bowie's lost San Saba silver mine. There they lived out their days among the Lipan Apaches, taking only what silver they needed to sustain themselves.
Eventually, Crockett took to wearing a mask, so that he would not be constantly hounded by the press and fans seeking autographs, or agents trying to get him back on the speaking circuit. Bowie, of course, remained at his side as his faithful companion, often mistaken for a silent Indian due to his laconic nature. Together they rode through lawless territories, fighting injustice and rounding up no end of bad guys.
Hi Yo Silver, Away!
AW
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Post by marklemon on Apr 2, 2009 22:38:43 GMT -5
I don't think either Crockett or Bowie died at the Alamo. There is no corpus delicti for either of them, nor reliable witnesses who can pin down their deaths, nor any other forensic evidence that would convince us that they died, let alone their manner of death. I'm thoroughly convinced that Bowie had progressed further along in his recovery from illness than we have been led to believe and was well enough to travel by March 6. I believe that he and Crockett made their way out of the fort through a secret tunnel (long since destroyed) that took them well beyond Sesma's cavalry somewhere in the vicinity of La Villita. With everyone's attention focused on the battle, they were able to easily "borrow" a couple of horses and get out of there in a hurry. They were then able to get provisions for a long journey from Bowie's local Tejano contacts and make their way out of the area, finally arriving at the still-secret location of Bowie's lost San Saba silver mine. There they lived out their days among the Lipan Apaches, taking only what silver they needed to sustain themselves. Eventually, Crockett took to wearing a mask, so that he would not be constantly hounded by the press and fans seeking autographs, or agents trying to get him back on the speaking circuit. Bowie, of course, remained at his side as his faithful companion, often mistaken for a silent Indian due to his laconic nature. Together they rode through lawless territories, fighting injustice and rounding up no end of bad guys. Hi Yo Silver, Away! AW HA!.....and don't forget, as they departed the Alamo, they took the New Orleans Greys' flag with them!! MHL
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Post by stuart on Apr 3, 2009 0:36:47 GMT -5
HA!.....and don't forget, as they departed the Alamo, they took the New Orleans Greys' flag with them!! MHL Yes, but traded it for a beer at the Menger before riding out.
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Post by Kevin Young on Apr 3, 2009 7:22:57 GMT -5
...and they faked the de la Pena diary to cover their tracks... ;D
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Post by stuart on Apr 3, 2009 7:40:48 GMT -5
...and they faked the de la Pena diary to cover their tracks... ;D Who do you think bought them the beers in exchange for the flag? ;D
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