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Post by sloanrodgers on Jul 14, 2008 20:16:52 GMT -5
Did anyone catch the pending Sunday (July 13) auction of this alleged Alamo/ San Jacinto sword in the Texas newspapers recently? I am not sure what specifically ties this weapon to these battles, but it must be true. The sword has a story and a historian to back up its authenticity. If that's all it takes, then I think I'm gonna dig up some artifacts in my back yard and put them on the market. ;D Alamo/ San Jacinto Relic www.1bid2.com/westernauction/sword.html
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Post by Herb on Jul 15, 2008 11:35:06 GMT -5
I am not sure what specifically ties this weapon to these battles, but it must be true. The sword has a story and a historian to back up its authenticity. If that's all it takes, then I think I'm gonna dig up some artifacts in my back yard and put them on the market. ;D Yeah, while I don't know the man, it sure doesn't appear that he even did any basic historical research. Gaona's Brigade, didn't include any soldatos that fought at the Alamo! They weren't even there.
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Post by TRK on Jul 15, 2008 12:18:33 GMT -5
For an artifact that, I expect, the auctioneers expect will fetch a big winning bid, they're pretty closed-mouthed about what they or the owners might know about the "saber."
It looks like any number of Confederate D-guard Bowies with extra-long blades. And, has anybody else noticed that the handle seems to be in surprisingly good shape for something that supposedly lay out in the elements for a century before it was discovered in that field?
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Post by Allen Wiener on Jul 15, 2008 12:54:33 GMT -5
Does it come with Crockett's letter from Texas? The one the Texas Historical Commission nearly paid a half-mil for?
AW
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Post by sloanrodgers on Jul 15, 2008 18:15:37 GMT -5
When I first saw this sword in the newspaper last Thursday I thought it resembled some crude Confederate pieces, but I havn't studied that era in awhile. It does look too pristene to have been buried for 60-70 years, then plowed up by a Garfield farmer. The hand grips look better than a chunk of Mesquite that I've had sitting on my porch for the last ten years. Even without Wolfpack's Gaona factor, I'm surprised anyone would pay so much for this blade with its weak provenance. Of course some collectors have money to burn.
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Post by Paul Sylvain on Aug 3, 2008 7:53:30 GMT -5
Does anyone know if this thing actually sold, and for how much?
This item is in way too good shape for something supposedly left to the elements for so long. I don'y buy it either.
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Post by texast on Dec 1, 2008 2:10:03 GMT -5
As wolfpack said "it sure doesn't appear that he even did any basic historical research"
Antonio Gaona was a general in the Mexican army at the time of the Texas Revolution. He reached the Alamo shortly after the siege had been completed and on March 24, 1836, was ordered by Antonio López de Santa Anna to march with 725 men to Nacogdoches by way of Bastrop and the Old San Antonio Road. On April 15 the orders were changed, and Gaona was directed to proceed from Bastrop to San Felipe to join Santa Anna's forces. He got lost between Bastrop and San Felipe, so his forces did not participate in the battle of San Jacinto. Gaona returned to Bexar and then to Mexico, where he was appointed commander of the fortress of San Juan de Ulloa, which he surrendered to the French fleet on November 28, 1838, during the so-called Pastry War.
BIBLIOGRAPHY: Hubert Howe Bancroft, History of the North Mexican States and Texas (2 vols., San Francisco: History Company, 1886, 1889). John Henry Brown, History of Texas from 1685 to 1892 (2 vols., St. Louis: Daniell, 1893).
It is highly unlikely that this sword saw any action but instead was dropped or lost probably during the retreat of the Mexican army from Texas. It would appear to me that the sword has no actual value in relation to either the Alamo or to San Jacinto other than being around the area at the time. It is still a good item maybe to have in ones collection of period artifacts and yes I agree also that unless it had been properly stored and cared for over time not to mention the fact of it being buried for how many years, that the whole story is a bit flakey IMHO, at least the part of it being as stated on the above link showing the sword and the very little detail there "There is also the possibility that the sword had been taken from a slain Alamo defender and might be recognized by one of the Gringos who were presumed to be in pursuit." By the time Antonio Gaona and his men had arrived at the Alamo any personal items would have already been claimed by others and it is highly unlikely that any one would give up such a treasure from the battle to one who was not there to begin with although it is possible for a trade to have happened if the soldier in question had something to offer to the seller so to say. The sword to me reminds me more of a cutlas type used primarily on ships or in the Navy's for close quarter battles such as when ships get boarded. Yes there were several from both sides that might have had such swords but not too many I don't think. So maybe I have brought up more questions than answers in regard to this item and it's actual history.
It would be interesting though to find out if it sold and what the complete narrative, signed and notarized by the owner accompanies the sword includes.
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Post by sloanrodgers on Dec 1, 2008 18:58:59 GMT -5
I started this thread and even I don't know if this slung blade was actually sold. I'm pretty sure it didn't fetch the price the owner and auction barker were seeking with the souped up Alamo/ San Jacinto "ties" or "association" in the media stories. I havn't seen any evidence that this sword was thrown away by an Alamo defender or Mexican soldier and doubt there's anything that connects it to the Revolution. If there was something tangible the owner and auctioneer would have presented it to strengthen the dubious tale of the sword's origin. It could be a Civil War sword, filibuster saber, militia blade etc. Who knows for sure?
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Post by Mark Barnett on Jan 9, 2009 18:28:22 GMT -5
Since this thread is about swords, I came here to ask a question about swords used at the Alamo. I've been searching some historic sword websites looking for photos of vintage swords that would date back to the time of the battle at the Alamo. I've learned a little, but not enough to know what I want to know. One person told me that someone like William B. Travis could of or might of used a sword like a model M-1833 US Dragoon Saber or a M-1820-'30 Militia Sword. Other swords he could of used would include a number of different style (eagle-head) designed swords. I just wanted to ask the question: What type of sword do you think Travis could of used while at the Alamo?
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Post by TRK on Jan 10, 2009 10:02:20 GMT -5
Mark 33, I advise you to get a good reference on U.S. swords, such as Harold L. Peterson's The American Sword, 1775-1945 (New Hope, PA: Halter, 1954), and study it. Nobody knows what kind of sword Travis had at the Alamo. For all we know, it could have been a Spanish, French, or Mexican weapon. All you can do is do your homework, and make educated guesses.
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